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	<title>Comments on: JPMorgan’s $29 Billion windfall</title>
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		<title>By: kfizzle</title>
		<link>http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/jpmorgans-29-billion-windfall.html#comment-56470</link>
		<dc:creator>kfizzle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 May 2009 01:33:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/jpmorgans-29-billion-windfall.html#comment-56470</guid>
		<description> Absolutely agree. The funny thing is that I thought the press had this backwards. I figured when it eventually came up, it would be about them NOT writing down the assets enough, not the other way around. I&#039;m not one to go media-hating, but it seems like some general misunderstanding. You buy the assets, and write them down to fair value. So the book value of the loans is written down, and, just like any other loan, they collect interest on them. The only way JPM gets anywhere close to the $29B number is if virtually all of those loans pay off in total. If that indeed becomes the case, then we&#039;ve all been hoodwinked, hah. I&#039;m pretty sure you can disprove that rather quickly by just reading Hempton&#039;s post about their assumptions at the time of the acquisition.

 The quirk in the actual accounting which references exactly what you speak of is the fact that when they take the assets onto their books, they actually record negative goodwill, but it doesn&#039;t really get &quot;impaired,&quot; because they have to net the costs of &quot;maintaining&quot; the gw against it. Maintaining = costs related to wamu/wach integration. So instead of expensing stuff like merger costs, they basically reverse-capitalize it against the negative goodwill booked versus the acquired assets. Kind of like the with imports declining faster than exports and boosting gdp as a double negative. Odd stuff that you almost certainly do not find anywhere else.

 
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Absolutely agree. The funny thing is that I thought the press had this backwards. I figured when it eventually came up, it would be about them NOT writing down the assets enough, not the other way around. I&#8217;m not one to go media-hating, but it seems like some general misunderstanding. You buy the assets, and write them down to fair value. So the book value of the loans is written down, and, just like any other loan, they collect interest on them. The only way JPM gets anywhere close to the $29B number is if virtually all of those loans pay off in total. If that indeed becomes the case, then we&#8217;ve all been hoodwinked, hah. I&#8217;m pretty sure you can disprove that rather quickly by just reading Hempton&#8217;s post about their assumptions at the time of the acquisition.</p>
<p> The quirk in the actual accounting which references exactly what you speak of is the fact that when they take the assets onto their books, they actually record negative goodwill, but it doesn&#8217;t really get &#8220;impaired,&#8221; because they have to net the costs of &#8220;maintaining&#8221; the gw against it. Maintaining = costs related to wamu/wach integration. So instead of expensing stuff like merger costs, they basically reverse-capitalize it against the negative goodwill booked versus the acquired assets. Kind of like the with imports declining faster than exports and boosting gdp as a double negative. Odd stuff that you almost certainly do not find anywhere else.</p>
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		<title>By: Edward Harrison</title>
		<link>http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/jpmorgans-29-billion-windfall.html#comment-56465</link>
		<dc:creator>Edward Harrison</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 May 2009 23:59:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/jpmorgans-29-billion-windfall.html#comment-56465</guid>
		<description>April 28: WaMu Sues JPMorgan to Recover $4 Billion in Deposits 
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&amp;sid=aeLWubzuiPL4

I believe other suits have also been filed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>April 28: WaMu Sues JPMorgan to Recover $4 Billion in Deposits<br />
<a href="http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&#038;sid=aeLWubzuiPL4" rel="nofollow">http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&#038;sid=aeLWubzuiPL4</a></p>
<p>I believe other suits have also been filed.</p>
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		<title>By: Edward Harrison</title>
		<link>http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/jpmorgans-29-billion-windfall.html#comment-56464</link>
		<dc:creator>Edward Harrison</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 May 2009 23:57:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/jpmorgans-29-billion-windfall.html#comment-56464</guid>
		<description>good synopsis, Kyle.  The press hasn&#039;t brought them up because the writedowns and losses had been overwhelming any of the other issues at the banks.  But, now that banks are looking more profitable, people are clearly wanting to know why?  After all, they were on the verge of collapse just months ago.  So how are they making so much money.

I would add that in most acquisitions, the asset writedowns are not as much because the acquired company is not being bought out of distress.  SO these are fairly unique situations in terms of the scale of the writedowns taken.

And as for the accounting, it is the same thing with operating earnings.  Companies trash their earnings and throw everything including the kitchen sink into one-time items.  So, that when the rebound comes, subsequent quarters look that much better.

And investors fall for this trick time and again.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>good synopsis, Kyle.  The press hasn&#8217;t brought them up because the writedowns and losses had been overwhelming any of the other issues at the banks.  But, now that banks are looking more profitable, people are clearly wanting to know why?  After all, they were on the verge of collapse just months ago.  So how are they making so much money.</p>
<p>I would add that in most acquisitions, the asset writedowns are not as much because the acquired company is not being bought out of distress.  SO these are fairly unique situations in terms of the scale of the writedowns taken.</p>
<p>And as for the accounting, it is the same thing with operating earnings.  Companies trash their earnings and throw everything including the kitchen sink into one-time items.  So, that when the rebound comes, subsequent quarters look that much better.</p>
<p>And investors fall for this trick time and again.</p>
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		<title>By: tyaresun</title>
		<link>http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/jpmorgans-29-billion-windfall.html#comment-56462</link>
		<dc:creator>tyaresun</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 May 2009 22:40:00 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>So why no law suits from Wamu bond holders?  I don&#039;t quite believe these numbers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So why no law suits from Wamu bond holders?  I don&#8217;t quite believe these numbers.</p>
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		<title>By: kfizzle</title>
		<link>http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/jpmorgans-29-billion-windfall.html#comment-56460</link>
		<dc:creator>kfizzle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 May 2009 19:26:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/jpmorgans-29-billion-windfall.html#comment-56460</guid>
		<description>In the case of JPM and WAMU, it is the WAMU bondholders, and the WAMU shareholders, because the HoldCo declared bk the next day (stock wiped out), and because JPM did not absorb the requisite sub and senior debt of WAMU. So yes, they basically paid $1.9 Billion for the rights to $118 Billion worth of assets. That is not the case with the NCB/USB and Wach/WFC deals. NCB  and Wach were outright bought, so the debtholders are still whole for the time being. WFC benefited by getting a -19B tax writedown from Wachovia (subsequently closed by Congress), and both banks &quot;benefit&quot; from the ability to writedown the assets to fair value. I personally do not see this as a benefit, as it is rather a staple feature of accounting, regardless of it being a financial institution or not. You can see the updated fair values of those loans on a quarterly basis in the notes to the F/S. I&#039;m kind of surprised it took ~8 months for someone in the press to bring this up though.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the case of JPM and WAMU, it is the WAMU bondholders, and the WAMU shareholders, because the HoldCo declared bk the next day (stock wiped out), and because JPM did not absorb the requisite sub and senior debt of WAMU. So yes, they basically paid $1.9 Billion for the rights to $118 Billion worth of assets. That is not the case with the NCB/USB and Wach/WFC deals. NCB  and Wach were outright bought, so the debtholders are still whole for the time being. WFC benefited by getting a -19B tax writedown from Wachovia (subsequently closed by Congress), and both banks &#8220;benefit&#8221; from the ability to writedown the assets to fair value. I personally do not see this as a benefit, as it is rather a staple feature of accounting, regardless of it being a financial institution or not. You can see the updated fair values of those loans on a quarterly basis in the notes to the F/S. I&#8217;m kind of surprised it took ~8 months for someone in the press to bring this up though.</p>
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		<title>By: tyaresun</title>
		<link>http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/jpmorgans-29-billion-windfall.html#comment-56459</link>
		<dc:creator>tyaresun</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 May 2009 17:45:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/jpmorgans-29-billion-windfall.html#comment-56459</guid>
		<description>Is there a losing party in this windfall?  Wamu bondholders?  FDIC? US taxpayers?  Did this money come out of thin air?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is there a losing party in this windfall?  Wamu bondholders?  FDIC? US taxpayers?  Did this money come out of thin air?</p>
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