<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Green Shoots or Smoking Weed?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/green-shoots-or-smoking-weed.html/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/green-shoots-or-smoking-weed.html</link>
	<description>Finance, Economics and Markets</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 10 Feb 2012 00:37:00 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	
<xhtml:meta xmlns:xhtml="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" name="robots" content="noindex" />
	<item>
		<title>By: Edward Harrison</title>
		<link>http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/green-shoots-or-smoking-weed.html#comment-56501</link>
		<dc:creator>Edward Harrison</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Jun 2009 18:53:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.creditwritedowns.com/?p=8869#comment-56501</guid>
		<description>Mark, it looks bad doing an about-face of that quickness, but the post was too good to pass up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark, it looks bad doing an about-face of that quickness, but the post was too good to pass up.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Bob_in_MA</title>
		<link>http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/green-shoots-or-smoking-weed.html#comment-56496</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob_in_MA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 May 2009 19:17:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.creditwritedowns.com/?p=8869#comment-56496</guid>
		<description>In adtition to pwm&#039;s point, another area where Jensen&#039;s calculations are probably off is in the total value of homes. The Flow of Funds uses valuation changes based on the index that derives from Fannae/Freddie. It didn&#039;t see as steep an increase as Case Shiller and probably won&#039;t see as steep a fall.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In adtition to pwm&#8217;s point, another area where Jensen&#8217;s calculations are probably off is in the total value of homes. The Flow of Funds uses valuation changes based on the index that derives from Fannae/Freddie. It didn&#8217;t see as steep an increase as Case Shiller and probably won&#8217;t see as steep a fall.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Bob_in_MA</title>
		<link>http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/green-shoots-or-smoking-weed.html#comment-56495</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob_in_MA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 May 2009 19:13:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.creditwritedowns.com/?p=8869#comment-56495</guid>
		<description>This is similar to the argument Russell Napier has made, and likewise Andy Xie. Napier actually sees the temporary upswing lasting a year or two and long Treasuries reaching 6%.

I have a hard tome seeing an upturn lasting even two quarters. It seems to me it will simply kill itself off. The 50 bps rise in bond and mortgage rates will increase carrying costs for the home buyer to increase about 5%. And the recent run up in gasoline prices effectively negates the decrease in payroll taxes from the stimulus.

I have a feeling that we might already be near the choke point that these three see coming later. Mortgage applications for buyers have been flat at very low levels for a while now, and in the UMich consumer confidence report (the one the market jumped on) people planning to buy a house fell for the third month. And that was before the jump in rates last week.

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is similar to the argument Russell Napier has made, and likewise Andy Xie. Napier actually sees the temporary upswing lasting a year or two and long Treasuries reaching 6%.</p>
<p>I have a hard tome seeing an upturn lasting even two quarters. It seems to me it will simply kill itself off. The 50 bps rise in bond and mortgage rates will increase carrying costs for the home buyer to increase about 5%. And the recent run up in gasoline prices effectively negates the decrease in payroll taxes from the stimulus.</p>
<p>I have a feeling that we might already be near the choke point that these three see coming later. Mortgage applications for buyers have been flat at very low levels for a while now, and in the UMich consumer confidence report (the one the market jumped on) people planning to buy a house fell for the third month. And that was before the jump in rates last week.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Terry</title>
		<link>http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/green-shoots-or-smoking-weed.html#comment-56493</link>
		<dc:creator>Terry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 May 2009 15:03:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.creditwritedowns.com/?p=8869#comment-56493</guid>
		<description>Wow! One of us has been channeling the other&#039;s mind!  But it is clear that Mr. Jensen has made a far more comprehensive and eloquent case than I ever could for the disaster American households face.  I&#039;m even with him on the late year economic rally--driven by stimulus and holiday spending--before a reversion to a downward GDP early next year for at least two quarters.  &quot;W&quot; is back!

The next step (if one accepts this economic analysis as I certainly do) is understanding its political ramifications.  

First, does the White House (Summers) and Treasury (Geithner) see the economy in the same way--at least privately?  

Second, if they do acknowledge this trend (privately anyway), what are their policy options for stemming household hemorrhaging?  

and Three, what are the implications for the the 2010 Congressional elections if the Administration does/does not address this issue?  (As badly disoriented as the Republicans are at the moment, it may not mean as much as it would have in other elections.  Still, it could make for a nasty campaign--but what&#039;s so different about that?)

Thank you for publishing this piece.  Sure wish ARP put this out publicly!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow! One of us has been channeling the other&#8217;s mind!  But it is clear that Mr. Jensen has made a far more comprehensive and eloquent case than I ever could for the disaster American households face.  I&#8217;m even with him on the late year economic rally&#8211;driven by stimulus and holiday spending&#8211;before a reversion to a downward GDP early next year for at least two quarters.  &#8220;W&#8221; is back!</p>
<p>The next step (if one accepts this economic analysis as I certainly do) is understanding its political ramifications.  </p>
<p>First, does the White House (Summers) and Treasury (Geithner) see the economy in the same way&#8211;at least privately?  </p>
<p>Second, if they do acknowledge this trend (privately anyway), what are their policy options for stemming household hemorrhaging?  </p>
<p>and Three, what are the implications for the the 2010 Congressional elections if the Administration does/does not address this issue?  (As badly disoriented as the Republicans are at the moment, it may not mean as much as it would have in other elections.  Still, it could make for a nasty campaign&#8211;but what&#8217;s so different about that?)</p>
<p>Thank you for publishing this piece.  Sure wish ARP put this out publicly!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: pwm</title>
		<link>http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/green-shoots-or-smoking-weed.html#comment-56491</link>
		<dc:creator>pwm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 May 2009 06:02:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.creditwritedowns.com/?p=8869#comment-56491</guid>
		<description>&quot;Almost one-third of all US households have no mortgage. If you adjust for that, the 70-80% debt-to-equity ratio suddenly becomes a major challenge because it means that the two-thirds who do have a mortgage already face a debt-to-equity ratio in excess of 100%. Even worse, once the mean reversion has run its course, two-thirds of US households will be facing a debt-to-equity ratio of 120-125% on average.&quot;

This thinking is a bit sloppy, probably for effect.  When all is said and done, the negative equity will be concentrated in about 30% of the outstanding mortgages.  That means about 20% of all households will be under water, maybe 25% if there is a serious overshoot. (Don&#039;t forget, about a third of the population rents.)  Yes, the wealth effect will be large for all homeowners, and losses to mortgage owners will be huge, but the overall situation is not quite as dire as construed by taking &quot;averages&quot;.

Otherwise he makes good points.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Almost one-third of all US households have no mortgage. If you adjust for that, the 70-80% debt-to-equity ratio suddenly becomes a major challenge because it means that the two-thirds who do have a mortgage already face a debt-to-equity ratio in excess of 100%. Even worse, once the mean reversion has run its course, two-thirds of US households will be facing a debt-to-equity ratio of 120-125% on average.&#8221;</p>
<p>This thinking is a bit sloppy, probably for effect.  When all is said and done, the negative equity will be concentrated in about 30% of the outstanding mortgages.  That means about 20% of all households will be under water, maybe 25% if there is a serious overshoot. (Don&#8217;t forget, about a third of the population rents.)  Yes, the wealth effect will be large for all homeowners, and losses to mortgage owners will be huge, but the overall situation is not quite as dire as construed by taking &#8220;averages&#8221;.</p>
<p>Otherwise he makes good points.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: baserunr</title>
		<link>http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/green-shoots-or-smoking-weed.html#comment-56486</link>
		<dc:creator>baserunr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 23:26:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.creditwritedowns.com/?p=8869#comment-56486</guid>
		<description>Not to mention that the effects of the Chrysler &amp; GM downsizings have not been fully felt yet, and that oil is now past $65/bbl.  And a full recovery is just around the corner?  Not likely.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not to mention that the effects of the Chrysler &amp; GM downsizings have not been fully felt yet, and that oil is now past $65/bbl.  And a full recovery is just around the corner?  Not likely.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Mark Wadsworth</title>
		<link>http://www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/green-shoots-or-smoking-weed.html#comment-56485</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Wadsworth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 20:24:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.creditwritedowns.com/?p=8869#comment-56485</guid>
		<description>When your post title popped up I was going to say that you just did one of the quickest changes in jargon-policy ever, but you&#039;d already &#039;fessed up, so fair play to you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When your post title popped up I was going to say that you just did one of the quickest changes in jargon-policy ever, but you&#8217;d already &#8216;fessed up, so fair play to you.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
<!-- This Quick Cache file was built for (  www.creditwritedowns.com/2009/05/green-shoots-or-smoking-weed.html/feed ) in 0.14369 seconds, on Feb 10th, 2012 at 3:01 am UTC. -->
<!-- This Quick Cache file will automatically expire ( and be re-built automatically ) on Feb 10th, 2012 at 4:01 am UTC -->
